Community Discussions and Support
Quoted Text

Have I got this right, the beardef.css file is loaded if *any* css file is referenced by a url-type link in an email?

Thanks for your ongoing help with this. We're trying to find the least painful solution to the quoting thing, unfortunately we have sent and received a lot of long formatted emails over the years, so when migrating our email we need to preserve the quoting in a way that allows it to be displayed unambiguously when we have to dig back in the archives (which happens all too often). The simple indenting doesn't clearly differentiate between indenting that was part of the original email's formatting, and quote-type indenting that is supposed to represent a later reply or comment to a previous section of an earlier email. Hard to describe but an affected email looks like format soup :-)

<p>Have I got this right, the beardef.css file is loaded if *any* css file is referenced by a url-type link in an email?</p><p>Thanks for your ongoing help with this. We're trying to find the least painful solution to the quoting thing, unfortunately we have sent and received a lot of long formatted emails over the years, so when migrating our email we need to preserve the quoting in a way that allows it to be displayed unambiguously when we have to dig back in the archives (which happens all too often). The simple indenting doesn't clearly differentiate between indenting that was part of the original email's formatting, and quote-type indenting that is supposed to represent a later reply or comment to a previous section of an earlier email. Hard to describe but an affected email looks like format soup :-) </p>

I am a new Pegusus user, migrating from Eudora.  I have a large archive of mail which is now on a Dovecot IMAP server.

Many of my archived emails are replies with quoted text in the form :

<blockquote type=3Dcite class=3Dcite cite>This is the quoted text.</blockquote><br>

Pegasus displays this as : 

     This is the quoted text.

Eudora and Thunderbird both display this quoted text with a vertical bar to the left of the paragraph of text.

|    This is the quoted text.

My problem is that when viewing these emails with Pegasus it is not easy to determine which text is

quoted and which text is not quoted.  This is especially a problem with

mails containing a long dialog of questions and answers.

Is there any way to configure Pegasus to recognise this form of quoted text, and display it in a more visually obvious manner?

&lt;p&gt;I am a new Pegusus user, migrating from Eudora.&amp;nbsp; I have a large archive of mail which is now on a Dovecot IMAP server.&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;Many of my archived emails are replies with quoted text in the form :&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;&amp;lt;blockquote type=3Dcite class=3Dcite cite&amp;gt;This is the quoted text.&amp;lt;/blockquote&amp;gt; &lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;Pegasus displays this as :&amp;nbsp; &lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; This is the quoted text. &lt;/p&gt; &lt;p&gt;Eudora and Thunderbird both display this quoted text with a vertical bar to the left of the paragraph of text.&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;|&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; This is the quoted text.&lt;/p&gt;My problem is that when viewing these emails with Pegasus it is not easy to determine which text is quoted and which text is not quoted.&amp;nbsp; This is especially a problem with mails containing a long dialog of questions and answers. &lt;p&gt;Is there any way to configure Pegasus to recognise this form of quoted text, and display it in a more visually obvious manner? &lt;/p&gt;

There is no RFC requirement to display BlockQuote in an particular style.   Internet Explorer, Firefox, and Opera (as well as Bearhtml) all display the same way, with just indentation for both left and right margins. The "<" or | is an email message convention, produced by emailers at the user choice, see Pegasus Mail help subject "Options for Replies"

HTH

Martin

 

&lt;p&gt;There is no RFC requirement to display BlockQuote in an particular style.&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; Internet Explorer, Firefox, and Opera (as well as Bearhtml) all display the same way, with just indentation for both left and right margins. The &quot;&amp;lt;&quot; or | is an email message convention, produced by emailers at the user choice, see Pegasus Mail help subject &quot;Options for Replies&quot;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;HTH&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;Martin &lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;&amp;nbsp;&lt;/p&gt;

Thank you for your prompt reply. 

The help subject you refer to covers replies generated by Pegasus, it doesn't affect Pegasus' rendering of existing html email.

Firefox renders the following html snippet correctly with a graphical bar up the left side of the quotation.

<html>
<body>
Hi <br><br>
<blockquote type=cite class=cite cite> This is the quoted text.</blockquote><br>
This is the unquoted text.<br><br>
Rgds<br>
</body>
</html>

While this is not mandatory, according to the W3 website http://www.w3.org/TR/1998/NOTE-HTMLThreading-0105 section 4.3 this is a recommended way of displaying quoted text in email.

Is there an alternative html construct or style that Pegasus will recognise or interpret in order to achieve the same effect?  I can create a script to reprocess the legacy mail, but my html knowledge is not up to the task.

Alternatively is it possible to specify an alternative html viewer to Pegasus?

&lt;p&gt;Thank you for your prompt reply.&amp;nbsp; &lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;The help subject you refer to covers replies generated by Pegasus, it doesn&#039;t affect Pegasus&#039; rendering of existing html email. &lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;Firefox renders the following html snippet correctly with a graphical bar up the left side of the quotation.&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;&amp;lt;html&amp;gt; &amp;lt;body&amp;gt; Hi &amp;lt;blockquote type=cite class=cite cite&amp;gt; This is the quoted text.&amp;lt;/blockquote&amp;gt; This is the unquoted text. Rgds &amp;lt;/body&amp;gt; &amp;lt;/html&amp;gt; &lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;While this is not mandatory, according to the W3 website http://www.w3.org/TR/1998/NOTE-HTMLThreading-0105 section 4.3 this is a recommended way of displaying quoted text in email.&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;Is there an alternative html construct or style that Pegasus will recognise or interpret in order to achieve the same effect?&amp;nbsp; I can create a script to reprocess the legacy mail, but my html knowledge is not up to the task.&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;Alternatively is it possible to specify an alternative html viewer to Pegasus?&lt;/p&gt;

Hi again,

quoting the article you refer to in your previous message: 

"...For example, quoted text in a BLOCKQUOTE may have a style applied which displays

a vertical bar to the left of the quoted section, as a more robust (and

wrappable) mechanism than putting "|" or ">" to the left of each line..."

You can see it is the sender that adds the BlockQuote tag with a class (CITE)  and the sentence:

"...In addition,

the receiving UA can alter the appearance on-the-fly of all text authored

by a particular individual.  (For example, to highlight all text written

by a particular individual) ..."

I don't think it wise for the mail client to insert tags into the message stream to be displayed.  This may alter the integrity of the message content for things like digital signature verification.

Pegasus Mail has a method to signal threading levels in a multiple layer message already.  I would suggest that composing a message in plain text and using these threading functions would be far easier than trying to inject html tags and Class definitions into a html message.

Martin

 

 

 

&lt;p&gt;Hi again, quoting the article you refer to in your previous message:&amp;nbsp; &lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;&quot;...For example, quoted text in a BLOCKQUOTE may have a style applied which displays a vertical bar to the left of the quoted section, as a more robust (and wrappable) mechanism than putting &quot;|&quot; or &quot;&amp;gt;&quot; to the left of each line...&quot;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;You can see it is the sender that adds the BlockQuote tag with a class (CITE)&amp;nbsp; and the sentence:&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;&quot;...In addition, the receiving UA can alter the appearance on-the-fly of all text authored by a particular individual. &amp;nbsp;(For example, to highlight all text written by a particular individual) ...&quot; &lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;I don&#039;t think it wise for the mail client to insert tags into the message stream to be displayed.&amp;nbsp; This may alter the integrity of the message content for things like digital signature verification.&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;Pegasus Mail has a method to signal threading levels in a multiple layer message already.&amp;nbsp; I would suggest that composing a message in plain text and using these threading functions would be far easier than trying to inject html tags and Class definitions into a html message. &lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;Martin &lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;&amp;nbsp;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;&amp;nbsp;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;&amp;nbsp;&lt;/p&gt;

To clarify my problem, we are migrating from Eudora to Pegasus.  I am trying to find a way to enable Pegasus to display historical sent emails which were generated by Eudora, in a way which is more readable.

Eudora appears to use "cite" blockquotes, so that is what I am stuck with.

I run a conversion script on the archived mail when it is imported to the new IMAP server, which potentially can replace or modify the blockquotes with something else.  This is a one off operation, as after the migration all sent mail will be generated by Pegasus.

My options appear to be :-

 - replace or modify the "cite" blockquotes with an html command that that would display a graphical bar to the left of the paragraph, however I have not been able to find a command that works.

 - define a style.  Can I do this and if so where should I put it?

 - investigate the threading functions you refer to.  Are they documented anywhere? I could not find anything in the help.

Thanks for you assistance and advice. 

&lt;p&gt;To clarify my problem, we are migrating from Eudora to Pegasus.&amp;nbsp; I am trying to find a way to enable Pegasus to display historical sent emails which were generated by Eudora, in a way which is more readable. &lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;Eudora appears to use &quot;cite&quot; blockquotes, so that is what I am stuck with.&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;I run a conversion script on the archived mail when it is imported to the new IMAP server, which potentially can replace or modify the blockquotes with something else.&amp;nbsp; This is a one off operation, as after the migration all sent mail will be generated by Pegasus. My options appear to be :- &amp;nbsp;- replace or modify the &quot;cite&quot; blockquotes with an html command that that would display a graphical bar to the left of the paragraph, however I have not been able to find a command that works. &amp;nbsp;- define a style.&amp;nbsp; Can I do this and if so where should I put it? &amp;nbsp;- investigate the threading functions you refer to.&amp;nbsp; Are they documented anywhere? I could not find anything in the help. Thanks for you assistance and advice.&amp;nbsp;&lt;/p&gt;

I found the following in my searches in a Microsoft Specification for RTF document

Revision Marks
  --------------------------------------------------------------------

  Control Word    Meaning
  ------------    -------

  \revisions      Turns on revision marking.

  \revprop<N>     Argument indicates how revised text will be
                  displayed: 0 for no properties shown; 1 for bold; 2
                  for italic; 3 for underline (the default); 4 for
                  double underline.

  \revbar<N>      Vertical lines mark altered text, based on the
                  argument: 0 for no marking; 1 for left margin; 2
                  for right margin; 3 for outside (left on left
                  pages, right on right pages; the default).

 So \revbar turns on this feature. I cannot find an equivalent html tag. You could try writing an RTF document and then saving it as Html to see how Microsoft do it.

Martin

&lt;p&gt;I found the following in my searches in a Microsoft Specification for RTF document&lt;/p&gt;&lt;pre&gt;&lt;i&gt;Revision Marks -------------------------------------------------------------------- Control Word Meaning ------------ ------- \revisions Turns on revision marking. \revprop&amp;lt;N&amp;gt; Argument indicates how revised text will be displayed: 0 for no properties shown; 1 for bold; 2 for italic; 3 for underline (the default); 4 for double underline. \revbar&amp;lt;N&amp;gt; Vertical lines mark altered text, based on the argument: 0 for no marking; 1 for left margin; 2 for right margin; 3 for outside (left on left pages, right on right pages; the default). &lt;/i&gt;&lt;/pre&gt;&lt;p&gt;&lt;i&gt;&amp;nbsp;&lt;/i&gt;So \revbar turns on this feature. I cannot find an equivalent html tag. You could try writing an RTF document and then saving it as Html to see how Microsoft do it.&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;Martin &lt;/p&gt;

I have figured out how to make the "graphical bar" quoting work in HTML; if I insert a style in an HTML email, as follows:

<style type="text/css"> blockquote {border-left: medium solid blue; padding-left: 0.25cm} </style>

then quoted text is displayed as indented with a "quote bar" as expected.

 
I could modify my mail conversion script to brute-force this solution, by inserting this style in every HTML email with quoted text, however I'd prefer to do it in one place instead of thousands. I have found that the BearHTML renderer appears to have a default CSS file called BEARDEF.CSS, but inserting styles in this file doesn't have any effect. That said, I don't know the file syntax that is expected, and I can't find any documentation to describe it. I have also tried setting "wantcss"=Yes in the .INI file but that doesn't make any difference either.

I tried downloading a later version of BearHTML (4.63) but this didn't work any differently, and it seems to be less robust than the version shipped with Pegasus - it sometimes causes Pegasus to crash when it encounters HTML that it doesn't like, whereas the earlier version just ignores the same HTML. So I have reverted to the earlier version.

Do you know whether there's any documentation or info that describes how to get BearHTML's default CSS file to work? 

TIA
 

&lt;p&gt;I have figured out how to make the &quot;graphical bar&quot; quoting work in HTML; if I insert a style in an HTML email, as follows:&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;&amp;lt;style type=&quot;text/css&quot;&amp;gt; blockquote {border-left: medium solid blue; padding-left: 0.25cm} &amp;lt;/style&amp;gt;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;then quoted text is displayed as indented with a &quot;quote bar&quot; as expected.&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;&amp;nbsp; I could modify my mail conversion script to brute-force this solution, by inserting this style in every HTML email with quoted text, however I&#039;d prefer to do it in one place instead of thousands. I have found that the BearHTML renderer appears to have a default CSS file called BEARDEF.CSS, but inserting styles in this file doesn&#039;t have any effect. That said, I don&#039;t know the file syntax that is expected, and I can&#039;t find any documentation to describe it. I have also tried setting &quot;wantcss&quot;=Yes in the .INI file but that doesn&#039;t make any difference either. &lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;I tried downloading a later version of BearHTML (4.63) but this didn&#039;t work any differently, and it seems to be less robust than the version shipped with Pegasus - it sometimes causes Pegasus to crash when it encounters HTML that it doesn&#039;t like, whereas the earlier version just ignores the same HTML. So I have reverted to the earlier version. &lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;Do you know whether there&#039;s any documentation or info that describes how to get BearHTML&#039;s default CSS file to work?&amp;nbsp;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;TIA &amp;nbsp;&lt;/p&gt;

If you want to embed your own CSS statements in an html stream, you should code WantCSS=Yes in Bearhtml.ini  and then insert the CSS statements in Beardef.css.  It sounds like you are doing this already, I will try to duplicate your solution.  I am not a CSS writer so my efforts may be thwarted by bad code but I will let you know.  BTW The latest Bearhtml does have this CSS support, but I have not heard from the original requester of the feature, so I have not advertised it, or documented it so far.

Martin

&lt;p&gt;If you want to embed your own CSS statements in an html stream, you should code WantCSS=Yes in Bearhtml.ini&amp;nbsp; and then insert the CSS statements in Beardef.css.&amp;nbsp; It sounds like you are doing this already, I will try to duplicate your solution.&amp;nbsp; I am not a CSS writer so my efforts may be thwarted by bad code but I will let you know.&amp;nbsp; BTW The latest Bearhtml does have this CSS support, but I have not heard from the original requester of the feature, so I have not advertised it, or documented it so far.&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;Martin &lt;/p&gt;

The current CSS support in Bearhtml only loads Beardef.css *if* the html stream contains a link to a remote CSS file.  I can confirm that your code does work in these conditions.  I will look into an option to insert this CSS trigger, if BlockQuote is detected.

Martin

&lt;p&gt;The current CSS support in Bearhtml only loads Beardef.css *if* the html stream contains a link to a remote CSS file.&amp;nbsp; I can confirm that your code does work in these conditions.&amp;nbsp; I will look into an option to insert this CSS trigger, if BlockQuote is detected.&lt;/p&gt;&lt;p&gt;Martin &lt;/p&gt;
live preview
enter atleast 10 characters
WARNING: You mentioned %MENTIONS%, but they cannot see this message and will not be notified
Saving...
Saved
With selected deselect posts show selected posts
All posts under this topic will be deleted ?
Cancel
Delete
Pending draft ... Click to resume editing
Discard draft